evangelist with a gun

[worthynfree]

I dont really have anything to add to this thread right now, but wanted to say .. WOW! There is a lot of powerful stuff here. So cool too, the way God brings us to read things that speak to each of us wherever we are in our walk with Him. He has been putting a lot of these same verses in front of me this past week.. and I even had a dream about Ephesians 3:17-19 a few days ago. Anyway, just love reading what you all have written.. its given me new direction in my own digging!
Basking in His Glory,
Sonja

[Charys]

Where can I read more about this?

I'll try to backtrack and find links to some sources. Beware that a search of 'harem' is a minefield of the salacious. Some of this I heard in a message by Kris Vallatton, on understanding how God works through all sorts of unexpected sources, but the most obvious clue is in the book of Esther itself.

Esther chapter 2
13Then in this way the maiden came to the king: whatever she desired was given her to take with her from the harem into the king's palace.

14In the evening she went and next day she returned into the second harem in the custody of Shaashgaz, the king's eunuch who was in charge of the concubines. She came to the king no more unless the king delighted in her and she was called for by name.

After her night with the king each 'contestant' was moved from the harem of virgins to the harem of concubines. (hint, hint) Whether or not the king remembered her depended on her performance that night. (My dad always said that if you read the Bible to your children they will have a complete s*ex education by the time you get to Micah.)

Sonja, this whole thing the Lord is teaching me here is probably elementary to a lot of people, but he is blowing me away. I'm so glad to hear he is showing you the same things. Did you post your dream on Eph 3:17-19? (some of my ultimate favourite verses!)

Another aspect hit me tonight. In the dream the evangelist was joined at the table by four men I assumed were ministers. I only recognized one of them who I know has an as-yet unfulfilled apostle calling (prophesied many times by people with excellent reputations). Of course! The men at the table represented the apostle, the prophet, the pastor and the teacher --and the evangelist! These are all mentioned in Ephesians as well. They are planning. Something is up.

Transition -because we are no longer what we were, but are not as yet fully what we are to become. Transition -because it is the shift responsible for the production of light. Transition -because our song of praise is being transposed into an even higher key.

[dborah777]

Again, this is rich! Thank you Charys. I'll print it out when I get to work and it's a start on some research of my own.

[worthynfree]

Charys,
Because of the recent transformation in my own walk.. it seems like anything I'd ever read or thought I knew before, is suddenly brand new to me. God is just popping stuff off the pages at me, and allowing me to experience it in all new ways. Its pretty incredible.

As for my dream on Ephesians 3:17.. I didnt post it, because it didnt need an interpretation. It was something the Lord shared with me, in answer to what I'd been seeking in Him. But maybe I'll post it when I have a minute later today.. just for the sake of sharing. In the meantime, Id like to print off this thread as well. Theres just such good stuff here to dig into! Thank You!!

[Charys]

I shared my dream with some people I don't usually tell about my dreams, because I was excited about what the Lord was showing me. One person said he was bothered by the idea of associating Jesus with a gun. He also didn't like it that someone would say that he had "an embarrassing tendency to play with the power." He suggested better, more peaceful images for Jesus.

I tried to explain it is difficult to edit the images in a dream.

Made me think, though. I am also really uncomfortable with both those things. Then I remembered Jesus telling John the Baptist's disciples, "Blessed is he who is not offended by me." and saying "I came not to bring peace but a sword." When he told the crowd, who were careful to follow Kosher food laws, that they had to eat his body and drink his blood, he so shocked and offended them that many left him at that point. He asked his disciples if they wanted to leave to and they said that even though what he just said was really hard, they would stay because they had no where else to go and they knew he had the words of truth.

There are many things about Jesus that I don't understand. My picture of him needs to expand.

I've learned that sometimes God does shocking thing to get our attention. Lately I've read Psalm 18 which speaks of God coming with earthquakes and fire and smoke and storms and violence and shooting arrows to scatter the enemy. Personally, there's a pacifist part of me that would like to edit those images sometimes.

Psalm 46 keeps popping up which says "Come and see the works of the Lord, how he has wrought the desolations..." Some translations say desolations and wonders, but there is no getting around desolations. I don't like that image either.

Sometimes God embarrasses me.

I'm busy witnessing to someone and he goes and does something that I can't explain, or messes with my tidy presentation. I'm learning that I can't be in charge of his P.R.. God is God; I am not.

As for the playing with power I am wondering if the God who created the duck-billed platypus, or the ugly fruit, or even something as wonderful and ridiculous-looking as s*ex has changed so much in character that there wouldn't still be an element of playfulness in his creative use of power. What's with the sparkly dust and gold teeth anyway?

My friend also said he didn't like the "Transition Version" part. He said he preferred to use a complete Bible. I agree that the Bible is a complete firm foundation sufficient for our faith. I don't think "Transition" means the Bible is in process here. We were in a shop recently with a long row of Bibles called things like "The Nurses Bible" "The Mother's Bible," "The Endtimes Bible," "The Plumber's Bible" etc. It struck me as being odd. I mean weren't they all the same Bible? It's just that some of them had their favourite passages in bold letters.

I think the "Transition Version" was a like this with passages like Esther and Ephesians emphasized so I could see them. I think those passages are about the church being in a time of transition.

Does this make sense?

[Jen]

it does to me.

[Newwine]

Hi Charys. I don't feel I get this all but will share somethings I may see. These things are things I myself have been prayerfully looking into for some time and sharing some.

Pink I feel can speak of emotions and as stated, this may be the foundation associated with this type of evangelism. I feel the way God created women that they can be more intune, so to speak, emotionally. Not saying men aren't, just as the more nuturers in our mothering roles, this seems to be something that we may more quickly generally connect to.

Emotions to me speak of intimacy and I personally don't care when emotions are disregarded because to me that is the icing on the cake. Mother Theresa said something to the effect of obedience without love is slavery. Love to me is a Being yet love is also expressed emotionally. Now we know emotions that are engaged apart from God can be unhealthy and lead to unhealthy ties, so not discounting dangers there, just saying when in conjunction with the heart of God it is something beautiful that nourishes the heart and soul.

Awhile back I was visiting I website that I would visit from time to time. Some of the things I would read on there were very grieving to me and this day I read something again that left me quite grieved. I liked the concept of the website but it just seemed to be heading in a direction that I found grievious. I logged on that day and posted for the first time. I opened my heart and shared my love for one of the individuals that was mentioned in a negative light, and how their ministry was a blessing to some I knew, and me. The response I got back was not at all what I expected and the person seemed to discount my heart and stomp on it. I decided I was not going to get into a detailed account of what I saw "right and wrong" with the individual because I felt that would lead to a discussion more rooted in knowledge than love (and feel the Lord showed me a few years back how he would defend him, so to speak, in time). I have nothing against discussing knowledge for I feel there is a place for that, just that it takes a backseat to those deeper issues of the heart, the love of God.

So basically what I said was even though I didn't feel we may see eye to eye on what may be more surface details, I felt at heart we were both sharing the same heart, a grievance for the condition of the body of Christ and as such we could relate to each other there, and come together in our shared pain and grievances and be united in prayer regarding those deeper issues.

We may not all see eye to eye when it comes to the surface details of thngs, but we all know what pain is. Pain, love, joy, suffering, sorrow, etc is an unspoken universal language that we all understand and unites humanity in that respect. These emotions are no respector of persons. Unfortunately, we can bypass that in our knowledge and the heart and soul is left desolate. Again, not saying we shouldn't speak the truth in love, as Jesus did to grieving Martha, but how we can all miss it there at times.

So wondering, if at least in part, the pink may speak of an emotional and intimate aspect that comes from being united to Christ and his heart for all.

In Ephesians Paul speaks of transitioning from our differences into the love of God. Or as He said in Corinthians, knowledge puffs up, but love builds up.

And interesting how you put in the princess aspect for I have been feeling the need to grow in more, and share more the aspect of women seeing themselves as princesses. Our Father God is the King of kings who created humanity to be united to Him through his Son. So in respect, all of humanity can be seen as a princess made to be united to God the Son, our Prince of Peace. We need to see ourselves in heart and mind as Princesses from the greatest Royal line.

Anyway, not sure if it fits in but thought I would share anyway for your prayerful consideration.

And I agree, marvelous insights shared.
Thanks to all.

Love in Him,
Joanne

[Charys]

Thank you, Newwine.
Again I am seeing more with your help.
Feminine emotions hmm?
I was struck by the fact the floor was soft, delicate and impractical -(like a soft heart?). Yet it was what it was. There was no judgment or complaining about the pink velvet floor or any indication there was something wrong with the floor or that it needed to be removed. The judgment is probably mine.

Maybe we just need to move gently, in a way that is sensitive to feelings?

hmm

Someone explained to me that feelings are like being thirsty. You don't condemn yourself for being thirsty. You decide whether you can wait to get a glass of water or whether you need to deal with it immediately, but you don't weep and wail crying that you don't know what's wrong with you, that you feel thirsty. So it is with emotions. You can accept them and decide how you're going to respond. They are what they are and deserve respect.

[Newwine]

Amen. I've described emotions as the gages in our car. I don't see them as good or evil but an indication of what is going on within the inside of the vehicle.

It can reveal our condition and as such we can take it to the Lord for help if we find ourselves depleted and such.

I see right and wrong as a condition of the heart and only in Christ can we see that clearly. And either way, no condemnation but HEALING in Christ.

Said somewhere before that if we stop short at the sin factor, we will miss the need. For instance, my pride, stubborness, etc, can be how I have chosen to fulfill a need. There is no shame in the need, just have to love the Light over the darkness. We can turn to Jesus, our Light.

Anyway, not to go off topic...just chiming in there.

[piano]

Really appreciating this thread and the wisdom shared here has helped me the last couple days.

This is the Biblical season of Purim. This is the time where Esther and all of Israel fasted 3 days for the salvation and deliverance of their people group. This is while they were in captivity. This is also dealing with the Prince of Persia (which is the modern day Iran) who continuously threatens to destroy Israel and is well on its way to have nuclear capability.
We can ask the Lord what He would have us to pray.
We can begin praying foundational prayers. The Lord's Prayer and Eph. 1:16-23.

I just found this in the thread and is confirmation of what the Lord has been showing me, not to take off course. Last night prayers that came to me were for the deliverance of Isreal, I think it is in a wide sense, not neccesarily the country, but Gods people in general.
Purim is a toss of the dice...God knowing the outcome as we weigh in, in faith.

Piano